clipping distortion

analog music reproduction discussion

clipping distortion

Postby nyazzip » Sun Dec 01, 2013 7:53 pm

just wondering if a cheap cartridge can cause or contribute to what sounds like, on loud passages, clipping distortion. the recording was done in the late '50s with audiophilia in mind; it is called "Provocative Percussion", so it is hard to imagine that signal clipping got by the engineers in the studio.
actually i just looked it up and here's a link....i have an affinity for the whole midcentury modern pre-rock thing so thats why i am referencing this....plus my dad owned and played this stuff on his Saba console when i was little.....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persuasive_Percussion

think its probably time to upgrade to a decent turntable; the one i use is a Neumark USB device from the early 2000s
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Re: clipping distortion

Postby Geek » Mon Dec 02, 2013 1:26 am

USB turntable *shudders* (sick) =:o

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Re: clipping distortion

Postby nyazzip » Tue Dec 17, 2013 12:45 am

so what is a good way of converting vinyl to .wav or comparable? without spending thousdands of dollars....
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Re: clipping distortion

Postby 20to20 » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:00 am

nyazzip wrote:so what is a good way of converting vinyl to .wav or comparable? without spending thousdands of dollars....


The most common way is to use a/the preamp output. Input that to a computer sound card "line in." Use the recording software set to 16/44.1. Wav format.

Do you have a sound card with a standard mini-jack line input? If not, go down to GoodWill and buy a 10 year old computer someone has thrown away for $10 and use that.

I'm still using an old Win 98SE machine for those duties but I record everything to 24/192K wav. then and burn to a DVD-A.
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Re: clipping distortion

Postby Geek » Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:15 am

You can breadboard a decent RIAA EQ with a couple TL072's and go to the soundcard [:)
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Re: clipping distortion

Postby hilldweller » Wed Dec 18, 2013 8:22 pm

This works for me,
Thorens TD-145 turntable with Stanton 681 EEE cartridge and stylus, ART USB Phono Plus phono stage.
http://artproaudio.com/artcessories/tur ... o_plus-ps/
A great combination that works very well!!!
Manual,
http://artproaudio.com/downloads/owners ... plusps.pdf
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Re: clipping distortion

Postby nyazzip » Thu Dec 19, 2013 11:36 pm

well i still don't have a functioning phono preamp so that is kind of why i wanted to stick with the USB output for now. but, tonight i played with the turntable using the analog/line out, and experimented with my own "RIAA" eq profiles using Cubase's step filter and eq functions. i sampled the vinyl at i think 48khz, and then exported .wavs at 40.1khz, 32 bit, and then played them from my laptop headphone output using Windows Media Player, into my st-35(Media Player won't play "Ogg Vorbis" format which is an export option in Audacity; still not sure what will play it). i experimented with 4-5 different versions of the same song, using "raw" right-from-vinyl sound, then a few of my own bass boost profiles, and finally an Audacity EQed version using their "RIAA" profile....but i could only export 16 bit with Audacity for some reason.
anywho, it isn't rocket science, i was able to get some good quality sound with some playing around.

a cautionary article i just found on high recording sample rates; haven't fully read it yet:
http://productionadvice.co.uk/high-samp ... und-worse/
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Re: clipping distortion

Postby Geek » Fri Dec 20, 2013 6:20 am

Any player *except* WMP will play ogg Vorbis ;)

M$ has an anaphylaxis to open-source :P
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Re: clipping distortion

Postby 20to20 » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:43 am

nyazzip wrote:well i still don't have a functioning phono preamp so that is kind of why i wanted to stick with the USB output for now. but, tonight i played with the turntable using the analog/line out, and experimented with my own "RIAA" eq profiles using Cubase's step filter and eq functions.

a cautionary article i just found on high recording sample rates; haven't fully read it yet:
http://productionadvice.co.uk/high-samp ... und-worse/



Does that TT analog/line jack have a switch? The TT may have a phono pre built in with RIAA using the line position. If there is no switch, then the jack may be just line level out already and then it would also be RIAA eq'd. They built those TT's for people who no longer had receivers or amps with a standard phono in, just aux/line. So it is probably already RIAA filtered.

nyazzip wrote:just wondering if a cheap cartridge can cause or contribute to what sounds like, on loud passages, clipping distortion. the recording was done in the late '50s with audiophilia in mind; it is called "Provocative Percussion", so it is hard to imagine that signal clipping got by the engineers in the studio.

think its probably time to upgrade to a decent turntable; the one i use is a Neumark USB device from the early 2000s


Getting back to this... The distortion you are describing is typical on marginal quality pressings and also from the combination of poor tracking of the stylus in those loud passages and the groove quality. If the stylus pressure is too low you can have tracking issues. If the stylus quality is cheap you can have tracking issues. If the pressing is cheap you can have tracking issues... All sound like distortion.

Also, if the LP is early enough, there won't be any RIAA used in the original record cut. How old is the LP?
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Re: clipping distortion

Postby DeathRex » Sun Dec 22, 2013 8:38 am

nyazzip wrote: a cautionary article i just found on high recording sample rates; haven't fully read it yet:
http://productionadvice.co.uk/high-samp ... und-worse/


I heard a piece on NPR about this lady engineer and DSD. It went on and on about this that and the other, never mentioning the sampling rate, even though they said "sampling rate" about 30 times. They did blind tests on CD, DSD and analog tape and most liked the tape better. Couldn't tell the difference between CD and DSD.
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